lee, what seems to be clear is that hagel is obama's guy, and at the end of the day fight chuck hagel all you want, but the person who is actually going to be dictating national security and foreign policy is sitting at 1600 pennsylvania avenue. >> absolutely. many people said when he first nominated hagel that, oh, this is picking a fight. i don't think anyone realized how much of a fight it would be. as this has played out. it's interesting that tom hagel has come out. he has only spoken a couple of times. the story of the two of them fighting together is quite powerful. he said way back when, he said if anyone thinks my brother is a pacifist, he is a fool. of course, it's his brother. anyway, i mean, it does look like it's probably likely, but it's -- >> it's surprising he is the one coming under the most scrutiny gin the fact that brennan is the architect of the drone and the cia and john kerry is at state and we don't have verbalized obama doctrine. it's because of some slight against mccane during the 2008 campaign, and now here we have senator mccain at the center of the hagel